Washington --- Charities told a federal agency Wednesday the government doesn't have any right to restrict how nonprofits solicit money by telephone even if they use commercial firms to raise money for the poor.

But representatives of the Federal Trade Commission rejected the argument.

''We do not agree with that,'' said Eileen Harrington, associate director for marketing practices at the commission.

She also said those arguments are not going to deter the government from writing new rules --- expected to be issued later this year --- that will create a ''national do-not-call'' list aimed at giving consumers some hope of dinnertime peace.

''Do you people want to call people who don't want to be called?'' Harrington asked during the first of three days of hearings with businesses and other interested parties on the final regulations to create the list.

How people will get on the list, and who will maintain it, have not yet been resolved. But the commission has received a record 42,000 comments from the public, backing government plans to bar telemarketers from telephoning those who put their names on lists stating they don't want to be bothered.

''We've never had that kind of response to a proposed rule,'' Harrington said.

The rule doesn't cover phone calls from banks or politicians. Charities headed a list of organizations demanding that their activities also be exempted from any crackdown on telemarketing that will come after the list is published.

''Nonprofits are beyond the reach of the FTC,'' said Glenn Mitchell, representing the Not-for-Profit and Charitable Coalition.

He protested that the new regulations would cover commercial telemarketers who raise funds for needy causes, and said that prohibiting charities from calling people whose names are on a do-not-call list would dry up fund-raising for the needy.

Patricia Klebs, director of the Special Olympics of Maryland, said her operation helps 9,200 children who depend on commercial fund-raising, which solicited funds from 75,000 people last year.

She said her 22-member staff doesn't have time to make money-raising phone calls, and the commercial operations raise a third of her charity's annual budget.

A national do-not-call list ''will have a devastating effect on our budget,'' she said.

Consumer groups countered that commercial fund-raising firms keep 60 percent of the money they raise for their operations, and prey on the elderly who are vulnerable to phone solicitors.